NFL Free Agency: Browns Add TE Ben Watson
March 12, 2010Break Up The Wahoos!
March 12, 2010
This is a fun time of year for Browns fans. This is the time when we get to improve (hopefully) and start to see the new regime start to mold the team in their images. I get the sense from the conversations on Twitter that it is also a source of consternation for a lot of you. It seems with every move the Browns make there is someone bemoaning every single move. Whether it is someone holding onto the fact that the Browns never should have traded Kellen Winslow, or someone inexplicably terrified that Brady Quinn might not get another shot to be the Cleveland Browns’ starter. So let’s take a trip down a road of lazy journalistic techniques and do some bullet points!
- First on Benjamin Watson. I know we all miss Kellen Winslow sometimes. Sometimes. Getting rid of Winslow was the right move even though it was painful. He wanted to be the top paid tight end in the league with ridiculous wear and tear on his knee. That was a bad bet. Benjamin Watson doesn’t have the top-end ability of Kellen Winslow. Then again, Watson is a legitimate upgrade over all the tight ends currently on the roster. As Scott said this morning, “A team that is in dire need of receiving options, Watson should instantly be featured in all pass-catching schemes.”
- Didn’t Justin Fargas visit the Browns? Well, we didn’t hear much about it. Fargas would actually be a good value signing, potentially. Fargas is 30 years old, but think of it this way. Fargas is no LaDainian Tomlinson, but he might actually be a better bet at this stage of their respective careers. Fargas is slightly younger in earth years, but is a million years younger in football years. He has about 827 career rushes and has never rushed more than 300 times in a season. That puts him over 2000 carries behind LDT overall and don’t forget that LDT has carried the ball over 300 times seven times in his career. Again, we haven’t heard much about Fargas other than he visited Cleveland, but he might be a nice balance to Jerome Harrison coming out of the Cleveland backfield.
- More on Tony Pashos. Last year when the Browns went out and got John St. Clair, I made a logic error in my analysis. My thought had been, “Well, Kevin Schaeffer wasn’t getting the job done, so John St. Clair couldn’t possibly be worse, right?” Well, I think I was wrong. So, I won’t say the same thing this season with regard to Tony Pashos, but from most accounts, this time, Pashos seems to be an upgrade at right tackle. Even still, Heckert’s statement indicates that Pashos will “compete” for the starting job. So, I will reserve judgement. I am excited that the Browns are working on giving the coaching staff more options on the right side of the offensive line.
- Scott Fujita is a definite upgrade for the Browns in the linebacking corps. He is not Ray Lewis. Still, by most accounts, Fujita brings experience, leadership and professionalism to the job while not bringing the advanced age that Willie McGinest brought to Cleveland.
- Seneca Wallace is not the quarterback of the future for the Browns. Still, I don’t understand why people are so antagonistic and protectionist with regard to Brady Quinn. If the Browns go into training camp and the pre-season with Brady Quinn, Seneca Wallace and Brett Ratliff, I don’t think that is an unfair competition to put him in.
- As far as Jake Delhomme goes, I don’t really see the benefit of having him on the roster, if as he says, he wants to be handed a starting job. Delhomme is at an age (35) and coming off a season in which he shouldn’t be handed anything but an opportunity to compete for a job. In the NFL you can’t rest on your laurels, especially if they occurred more than a year ago and your age can be rounded up to 40 mathematically. The OBR reported that the Browns and Delhomme did discuss general contract issues, but the team would not promise him a starting role.
- Philly apparently wants a #1 draft pick for either Kevin Kolb or Donovan McNabb. Obviously the Browns need to play the game and try to get the best deal for themselves as possible. Still, if Tom Heckert believes Kevin Kolb is the QB of the future for the Browns, I don’t care what price he has to pay within reason. Yes, this includes a first round draft pick if Heckert really thinks he is “THE” guy.
That is all I have right now, but I will leave you with one parting shot. Nothing is sacred. On a team that is as bad as the Browns were this past season, it is time to stop clinging to things that have been known to fail. Brady Quinn is not a sure thing. Even if you want him to have another shot, stop acting like his stats are meaningless. If you believe in Mike Holmgren and Tom Heckert at all, trust that they might know a little something about NFL rosters including the quarterback position.
(AP Photo/Mark Duncan)
35 Comments
I’ve been a Quinn fan since his time at Notre Dame (and I still think he deserves a fair shot at the job), but if the office found a way to get Kolb here, I think I’d be ok with that.
The question, of course, would be getting any sort of value back in exchange for Quinn (which sort of says a lot about his prospects of being a quality starter in the league, doesn’t it?).
Completely agree about BQ. Loved the move down and drafting of him when it happened being a cbus kid as well as seeming to have some talent, he hasn’t proved anything. Quarterbacks are Holmgren’s thing. If he thinks he can’t mold and shape BQ into what he wants, then I believe he’s not the answer. But I also would much rather see Brady get one more shot then see Seneca Wallace start just because we don’t have anyone else and he happens to be comfortable in the big man’s offense.
@TBrown I’m right there with you, couldn’t have said it better myself. If they could bundle Quinn and a later round pick for Kolb that would be great.
@Craig I completely agree about Fargas. He would be a great value vet, and hes no where near the mileage of alot of other guys out there. Plus, watching their games he was probably the best back Oakland ran out there last year.
BTW just to satisfy my curiosity….does anyone else think that signing Delhomme would be terrible? I mean they guy was serviceable when they had a healthy and younger Mushin Muhammad (sp?) and Steve Smith was still “the” Steve Smith but man has this guy fallen off. I just really really hope they don’t waste the money/roster spot on him….but really excited about everything else up to this point.
@ stin4u I would hate a Delhomme signing. The only way I see that happening is if they plan on drafting a QB and using Delhomme as a stopgap while the new guy develops, but even then I’d rather just see Wallace take the reins. I watched a couple Carolina games last year, and Delhomme looked terrible. Not “bad,” but “terrible.”
More QB talk from the posters…shocking…I look forward to the day when that position is filled just so “fans” of the Orange and Brown have to discuss other things. Even then I’m sure it’ll still creep into conversations because that’s all people seem to know.
Watson was a great sign regardless of who is at QB with him and Moore the team now has two weapons at TE. Heck the TEs might be better then the WRs. Pashos should definitely be an upgrade and solidify the right side. Fujita will help like I said he’s no Jack Lambert part deux but he should help. Not sure on Wallace I can’t imagine he’s a long term signing.
I was hoping the Browns would sign someone to strengthen the secondary in addition to upgrading it in the draft but with 3 offensive signings and just 1 on defense it appears as if my strategy of drafting defense (I hope) and signing offense is afoot.
Brodney Pool signed with the Jets.
The chance to be a virtual gm from home is incredibly addictive. I find myself checking google news constantly to see if the browns have signed that day’s visitor! That said, I love the Ben Watson signing. He is a viable first string all around NFL tight end who can serve as a mentor for Evan Moore. Steve Heiden immediately becomes a value player at 2nd or 3rd string. I also like the Seneca Wallace trade from a compensation standpoint and as a player. He was an athletic wunderkid in college, has very solid NFL stats, and if he was 3 inches taller would be a starter on a playoff team. The current era which features the wildcat might make this the perfect time to see if he can find throwing lanes without suffering an inordinate number of tips and batted balls due to his height. He does throw overhand whichvis a plus. Scott Fujita is a solid professional linebacker, nothing more nothing less. Tony Pashos I know absolutely nothing about, I hope he’s worth 3 mill a year! Brady Quinn’s release is too slow for the NFL. He seems to manage a game well and does have some athleticism but with that release and apparent mediocre arm strength I just would rather have Wallace or some other option. I love this time of year and Fargas might be a good value buy or he might be hurt for 70% of his contract.
Last credible report out of Philly said the Eagles want 2 first round picks for Kolb and 1 first rounder for McNabb.
“I don’t really see the benefit of having him on the roster, if as he says, he wants to be handed a starting job. ”
If this were true, why is even bothering to visit with New Orleans?
NOLA.com
I get the hometown thing, but New Orleans would be the very last team in the league where he would be the starting QB.
All that said, I don’t want him. He stinks.
I said it under the original Watson story already, but Watson will be a huge help for Quinn if the Browns stick by him. Since he’d be a frequent target of Quinn’s, opposing DEFs will have to respect him as an option, possibly eliminating a DB or two in deep coverage.
Thanks for update. Two 1st rounders for Kolb is ludicrous. The number 7 for McNabb who is 33 is intriguing. If we got 3 good seasons out of him he would be 37 at end of 2012-2013. Could he be the next Kurt Warner? He knows the west coast offense but is not just a dink-a-dunk type, he has a gun: see Desean Jackson highlights. I don’t know that he is exactly General Patton when it comes to leading the troops but with Mr. Holmgren in charge and Mangini his lieutenant the browns have leaders. The question is would we be better off investing the pick in Eric Berry or Joe Haden and grabbing a Combine star like Jarrett Brown in 2nd or 3rd round and potentially solidifying two critical positions for years to come?whew! I’m glad I don’t have to make that call.
Fargas has “about” 827 career carries? Just wondering…
If Quinn’s stats aren’t meaningless, they’re about one million times less meaningful than that No Logo Needed post makes them out to be.
singing delhomme would be the QB equivalent of the Willie McGinest signing.
he’s past whatever prime he had
agreed with 8 basically. your a bit high on wallace but i do feel that he will be a good starter for about 2 years he will be needed to until a rookie we draft this year can fill the spot.
@Boogey: “Heck, the TEs might be better then the WRs.”
“Heck, the TE’s are a billion times better then the WRs.”/fixed
Where’s Torry Holt? Can’t we get him to visit Cleveland? Why not?
The Kolb talk is insanity. Look at his career stats. 3 starts, 2 of them, blowout losses. All in an offense that’s a billion times more stable than anything Quinn has played in here.
Frowns,
I made a comment to this effect in a post earlier today, and I’ll trot it out to you, as you may have some know-what on this:
Do you know whether there is a QB completion statistic that does not penalize the QB for routes incorrectly run or passes dropped?
@17 Frowns I was trying to be somewhat generous to the Browns WRs but I agree with you which is why I was in favor of trading for Anquan Boldin who Baltimore received for just a 3rd and 5th round draft picks. Imagine Boldin along with Watson and tell me whoever played QB wouldn’t be upgraded. Oh well.
As far as Quinn goes he’s under contract and I could be wrong but I think alot of his salary is incentive based so I can’t understand why so much time is being devoted by the new management of the Browns at the QB position. If it were me Quinn would be here let him battle Wallace and in a year if that position is as bad as it is now, then do something. I think it’s unrealistic to bring in any QB and expect them to be a savior when, as I’ve said a million times prior, this team is like Swiss cheese with holes.
I’m not in favor of trading for Kolb or McNabb certainly not if it costs you the #7 overall pick and a chance to possibly add an Eric Berry. I can’t imagine Berry slipping to #7 but even still the Browns need a playmaker not another QB who is an unknown.
Matt#2: I’m not aware of any such stat, though if it’s anywhere, it’s at Football Outsiders. Would be an incredibly difficult stat to compile. And would it be able to capture a simple inability for the receivers to get open? I don’t know.
Boogey: You’re preaching to the choir, man. The only thing in your comment that I don’t agree 100% with is swiss cheese, because I do think the team is quite strong at some positions (i.e., in the trenches, linebacker). The issue is that the holes that the team does have with the pass-catchers and in the secondary are so massive that it keeps the team from competing no matter how good the other positions are.
I’d give a first for Kevin Kolb, but it would be NEXT YEAR’s 1st. That way if he does become worth the pick it is theoretically much lower than number 7.
The most important thing that everyone seems to overlook…. It doesn’t matter who we bring in at QB, We’ll still lose 10+ games. Our Offensive Coordinator is STILL Brian Daboll.
Brian Daboll would make Peyton Manning look like Ryan Leaf
Let’s talk about the buckeyes beatin Mich and vying for the #1 seed. That’s news!
@20 The defense has a ton of wholes I think the line is obviously a strongsuit but the Browns LBs and certainly there secondary are less then stellar. I think the LBs were in question which is why you saw the first free agent signing be a LB in Fujita. The secondary is the worst part of the team and has been that way for years.
On offense other then what else but QB a #1 WR and another RB for depth their in good shape.
@Frowns… my only point on Quinn was that the numbers aren’t meaningless. Brady Quinn has not set the world on fire as a starting quarterback. At this point, I am not opposed to giving him another shot as a starter even with my lack of confidence in him in general.
Having seen what I saw last season, I would be quite upset with the Browns and their management if they continued to stand pat and “hope” that Brady Quinn just becomes the starter. I dream of having people actually want to trade for one of the Browns’ QBs like Philly has this season.
As I said, go ahead and give Brady a shot, but why wouldn’t we all welcome the potential of a QB being brought in that makes Brady look stupid by comparison? I hope the Browns do find that guy in trade, free agency or in the draft. How could I be a Browns fan and not root for that? I don’t care who plays quarterback as long as they don’t stink.
Daboll is definitely overmatched. I am afraid that for the team to develop an adequate offensive identity he needs reassigned or he needs immediate help in the form of an offensive assistant who is hired and placed Holmgren/heckert so he knows the score. I know Gil Haskell is helping him currently.
The front office definitely needs to focus on the defensive secondary and a veteran wide out I.e. Torry Holt from here till the draft. If Tampa bay can snag Reggie Brown for a 6 there Cromartie goes for a 3 then we were either asleep at the wheel or too focused on QB games.
Other than Pashos, I like the moves we’ve made I just hope we don’t keep missing out on bargains like Thomas Jones. If they’re determined to get a young qb they should focus on Jarrett Brown in the draft or Charlie whitehurst for a third round tender from San Diego.
What is with the man crush on Quinn?!?!? Get over him, the guy has done nothing for this team and it’s time to move on! New regime new QB deal with it and hope for the best, Quinn is not the answer and never will be. There are reasons he fell in the draft. The Browns are the ones that got suckered in to moving up, and giving up draft picks to find it out the hard way.
I’ll echo some earlier posts in saying that Justin Fargas would be an excellent and cost effective addition to the Browns running game. Not to mention the added benefit of having Huggy Bear in the dog pound. Damn!
Fargas and Thomas Jones could be good older contributors for reasons listed by others. I think Watson is a quality signing, along with Fujita, and don’t know anything about Pashos. Kolb is the only guy I see reasonably giving up the first rounder for given his circumstances – I wouldn’t, but I also don’t resemble a walrus.
Mcnabb would be a terrible, terrible, terrible pickup at #7 overall. The top of the first round is for selecting franchise players who will be on your team for 8 years or more, not for picking someone who, at best, won’t decline precipitously and might have a couple good years in him tops. That guy who said he could be the next Kurt Warner – hey, where did the Cards pick up Warner? They signed him for a one-year, cheapish ($4mil) contract. They didn’t give up the #7 overall pick for him. And they signed him as a backup, which he was, for a couple years, knowing he wasn’t going to demand to start and go from Pro Bowl receivers to the garbage heap. And after successfully rebuilding the team, they STILL only had 2 years to make a run before he retired.
Delhomme would be another terrible signing. Panthers fans disliked him last season at a level comparable to Cleveland fans disliking, well maybe not Couch, but DA at least. Think about it. We just dumped a QB who choked routinely in the biggest games, so why would we want a QB who choked WORSE in BIGGER games and will almost certainly cost more?
The bottom line is that this roster is definitely improving one trade/signing at a time.
Like Craig so eloquently illustrated, basically every move the Browns have made this offseason has improved that specific position on the roster. Browns fans can’t ask for much more right now.
Very happy with the new regime’s efforts thus far.
Four reasons I don’t want to see Delhomme wearing the Orange and Brown next year:
1. He’s a little old for my liking
2. Isn’t Jake basically DA + 7 Years?
3. I don’t want QB dilemma (neither does walrus)…if Delhomme and Brady are here together, what’s stopping people from chanting the others name after the starter has thrown 2 pics?
4. I don’t want to have to hear Berman’s stupid “Day light come and I want to Delhomme” every time I watch Browns highlights on ESPN
29 should read the news before he types. Thomas Jones signed with K.C. 3 days ago and both Philly and Cleveland have been quoted as not interested in signing the injury prone since college Fargas. Also the asking price for Kolb is reported to be two first rounders for acguy who has 4 tds against 7 ints and a 68,qb rating, right there with Brady Quinn. Conversely, McNabb threw for 22tds against 10 ints with a rating of 92.9 and has a career rating of 86.5. My point in comparing him to Kurt Warner is that he is currently an excellent NFL quarterback who thrived in Philly with only one elite receiver, could help shepherd the browns through the rebuilding process for a couple years and still have something left when the team is ready to make a serious run at success. If you look at it like that then I still say acquiring him for a #1 and drafting an understudy like draft combine star Jarrett Brown with their number 2 or signing Charlie Whitehurst for a 3rd round tender would make logical sense. This is certainly a better scenario then anything involving Quinn or Delhomme.
“As I said, go ahead and give Brady a shot, but why wouldn’t we all welcome the potential of a QB being brought in that makes Brady look stupid by comparison?”
Sure. Who wouldn’t welcome that? The problem is, who is that guy? Because it sure isn’t Kevin Kolb, and given the likely price, it’s probably not McNabb either. So if it’s someone in the draft, even still it makes sense to give Quinn a chance to perform with a franchise with some semblance of stability.
Steve Heiden is no longer with the Browns. 🙁 I was dumbfounded by this move. I like Watson, but did they need to get rid of Heiden?
[…] looking to get his career back on track. When he visited Cleveland, there were reports that initial numbers were discussed, but the quarterback would not sign if he would not have a chance to start. Delhomme was slated […]