WFNY Podcast #4
September 4, 2008Injury News: Antwan Peek Out for the Season
September 4, 2008I know it is tempting (especially in Cleveland) to get angry with athletes who leave for greener pastures and bigger paychecks. I am guilty of getting angry about it sometimes too. In his latest opinion column, Bill Livingston (sarcastically) analyzes the recent newspaper advertisement that CC Sabathia took out to thank the fans of Cleveland.
In view of the poverty statistics, which list Cleveland as the second-poorest city in the country, it was nice of Sabathia to honor the little people who paid the freight for his on-the-job training until he moved on to greener pastures. Maybe $72 million over four years doesn’t go as far as it used to, although it would seem to go far enough to test MapQuest.
I am not going to do that whole stone-throwing thing here smashing Livingston because I have lived in that glass house. I got mad at Manny Ramirez for jumping ship when Cleveland made what I considered to be a very fair offer. I was angry with Jim Thome and CC Sabathia when they didn’t re-up here in Cleveland. At the same time, it might be time to analyze the viewpoint that these feelings are coming from.
It is one thing to get angry at a guy like Carlos Boozer. Some anger should be reserved for the stupidity that gave Carlos a chance to screw over Cleveland. Still, it is hard to argue with fans that hold a grudge against the man who seemingly lied his way out of a situation so he could chase more money in Utah.
Boozer, aside, all this bitterness and anger that I let myself feel over players leaving Cleveland for more money is deeply rooted in jealousy. I am jealous of cities who can entertain payrolls with $20 million players. As fans, I think we are jealous and sometimes even resentful of the amount of money that these guys are signing for.
But to an even greater extent, we are resentful of the margins that they are seemingly willing to leave for. It isn’t that CC Sabathia is going to make $20+ million dollars per year. It is that $18 million per year wasn’t enough to make him sign. Every town thinks their $18 million is worth more than the next town’s $20 million. Maybe that is a flaw in our way of thinking, not the player’s.
We just think about it differently. To us, there has to be a cost associated with switching teams and moving to another city, right? To us, there has to be a cost associated with having the burden of converting a new city into fans of yours, when you have a perfectly good fanbase in existence already, right? As fans we think that surely these two switching costs alone should equal the extra margin being offered between the two contracts.
But more often than not, it doesn’t. These are professional athletes. They have confidence that most normal humans could only dream of. They don’t worry about performing for fans in the next city. They just assume they will be able to live up to the hype and be adored. Look at CC. Tell me that Brewers fans don’t love him right now as much as we ever did when he was wearing a Tribe uniform.
Sometimes it doesn’t work out to your advantage like A-Rod getting booed in New York all the time, but apparently the extra money makes it all worthwhile. He opted out last year and practically begged them to come back to the bargaining table even though the fans have treated him badly ever since he showed up there.
I don’t offer any conclusions here, just some analysis. Different people will draw their own conclusions. Some will say the game is broken. Some will say that fans need to stand up for themselves. Some will say that owners are the problem. Some will blame the players as Livingston seemingly does. Finally, some will blame all of the above.
Where do you fit in?
14 Comments
Livingston is a relic left over from a time past. Once everyone ( the fans mainly ) understand that there is almost zero allegiance left in professional sports, the hatred should subside. As much of a fan that I am, I realize that all professional athletes are basically mercenaries.
The real question is, if we had a loaded payroll like the Yankees, how many people in this town would really go out and spend $1200 for a field box seat, which will be $2500 per game next year.
that’s why the NFL will always be better than major league baseball
braylon edwards, joe thomas, josh cribbs, brady quinn… none of those guys will bolt for a bigger market and a ridiculous contract that we can’t afford
if they leave, it will be because management/ownership didn’t want to pay them, not because new york or chicago or boston is going to outmuscle us for them
baseball is unfair for small cities.
as much as i want to blame the dolans, you can’t put all the blame on them.
Livingston’s column was bitter and stupid. This calls for bullet points:
– professional athletes are not the only people that leave employers and cleveland behind because they can get more $ in bigger cities. Every day professionals in cleveland consider whether they should give up the low cost of living in C-town for the extra 60-100K they could make in NY/CHI/LA ect. I’m pretty confident Livingston would leave the PD if the NY times offered him a 200K raise (about 1/10th of the extra $ CC thinks he can get).
– the idea that CC should have stayed in Cleveland b/c we provided him with “on the job training” doesn’t make any sense. Every MLB team provides on the job training. It’s not like the Indians took a loss on his first few years with the team; MLB isn’t running an internship program.
– The fact that Cleveland is the 2nd poorest city is irrelevant. Cleveland is high on the poverty stats b/c the city limits don’t encompass the much more affluent suburbs. The vast majority of the people going to the games don’t live in Cleveland proper. Legitimately poor people don’t go to baseball games; nobody every missed a mortgage payment so they could fund CC’s salary.
– “Maybe $72 million over four years doesn’t go as far as it used to, although it would seem to go far enough to test MapQuest” – this is a terrible sentence. It’s awkward, poorly organized and the metaphor is stupid. Is anybody editing that paper?
– I thought taking out the advertisement thanking the fans was a really cool thing to do. It was nice to see the fans in Cleveland made an impression on CC. He didn’t have to do it and doesn’t deserve to be mocked by a bitter sportswriter with an axe to grind.
Archi is right on…plus, the reason most of these guys leave for the very last dollar is because of internal “union pressure”. Giving the “home team” discount ends up hurting the other union members because one players salary is compared against another when it comes time to negotiate—so, there is a tremendous amount of pressure on the players to test the market and sign with whomever gives the most money over the most years. The only thing I disagree with is that it is unfair for smaller cities–it is only unfair for “small” owners who don’t have deep pockets…they knew the rules prior to buying a team in a certain market and then cry about it being too small, etc….
Gskal, I agree completely. We can just be happy that the NFL owners (wisely) told Larry Dolan that he didn’t have the financial resources to be an NFL owner. He wasn’t able to buy the Reds, either. It was only when Dick Jacobs was able to get him to bid against himself and pay through the nose for the Indians that he became an owner. Now, he wants to play destitute. Larry Dolan escapes blame, but shouldn’t.
Livingston is completely irrelavent on the Cleveland sports scene. If he wasn’t on the front page of the P.D. – he wouldn’t have a readership of two dozen…. This column, coupled with his anti-modern Olympics rant – seems to imply he’s trying to create this angry Mickey Rooney or “mad as hell and not going to take it anymore” persona. Sorry Bill – not buying it. You’re a lazy columnist truding up weak controversy at best. Go away and join Bob Dolgan in the bitter PD writers hall of shame. Adios!
You got it for me. It pisses me off that $18mill here isn’t good enough. That’s why I quit following baseball and won’t return until there’s a salary cap.
True, it’s good that the Yankees, and the redsox since 2004 can afford more, but it’s not good for the health of the league.
——————————
archi, your first point is way off. No one making $100k in Cleveland is debating moving to NY for $200k. I might not even spend time to sell my house since I could just pay it off in a couple years.
A design engineer would make $75k in OH, and $90k in NY. The standard of living would require a salary of $120k. So even if it did double like you imply, you wouldn’t pocket anymore.
A friend took a $20k/yr paycut to move from DC to Ohio but has MORE disposable income.
Remind me not to bring up Tony Grossi on here. Apparently there is no love for anybody that the PD has on staff other than Terry Pluto. And seriously if I hear one cross word about Pluto, I might lose it.
i love terry pluto.
Sorry, but Pluto is only a half step above grossi. His podcast is awful. The writing and opinions on WFNY and other blogs is way better than anything the “pros” at the PD can put out. If the same insider access was given to bloggers that the bozos at the PD get, there would be no reason to ever read the PD again.
With the exception of Windhorst. He actually puts out a nice product.
the critique is larger than any single player – if you carry it to its ultimate end, it’s really about capitalism. We can’t hold a single person accountable for maximizing the value that the market presents to them–to not do that would be bucking the forces of capitalism. When avarice triumphs loyalty it is disappointing for sure, but after Belle, Ramirez, Thome, etc it’s a pretty banal outcome. Not sure why Livingston has been animated by such spite.
Boozer’s case is different because he actually pledged his loyalty, whereas with the other guys we project an expectation of loyalty onto them. I’d like to think I could choose loyalty over dollars but wealth is a wonderfully distorting thing (hope to be tested w/ this dilemma one of these days, haha)
I hope Livingston doesn’t write a column about me.
I left Cleveland 30 years ago to pursue opportunities elsewhere. Will I get tarred and feathered if I show my face there again? I didn’t even take out a newspaper ad. Yikes.
C’mon, people… Livingston’s byline photo clearly shows his hand to his chin(s), so he’s obviously more insightful that we could hope to be.
P.S. – Awkward Mapquest metaphors are soooo 2003.