Indians Game #5 Open Thread: Tribe @ Detroit
April 10, 2010While We’re Waiting…Shaq’s Return & Pace of Play, Fausto Looking Good, Critiquing Holmgren’s QB Moves
April 11, 2010The Cavaliers lost to the Indiana Pacers last night in what was, in all reality, a meaningless regular season NBA game. The Cavaliers top four scorers were held out of the game due to injury or rest. Shaquille O’ Neal continues to rehab and had last night’s game been a must win or an important playoff game, the big fella would have, in all likelihood, suited up. Antawn Jamison was held out after Luol Deng landed on his ankle in Chicago Thursday night. LeBron James and Mo Williams were inactive as well. The Cavaliers have two more regular season games left and we may see lineups comparable to what we saw last night. There is really no downside to holding your most important players out in what are meaningless games.
The heavyweight matchup tomorrow afternoon with the Orlando Magic has become much less appealing than when it was originally scheduled. The Magic have been playing the best basketball in the league over the past month and will surely stand between the Cavs and an Eastern Conference title. But the rash of recent injuries to Andrew Bogut, Chris Bosh, and Hedo Turkoglu – key players for playoff contending teams – serve as a reminder to the Cavs and Coach Brown that discretion and caution should be valued over competition in this final week. Brian Windhorst wrote yesterday that LeBron will probably be shut down for the season:
What Mike Brown is doing is controversial and so is this: he may shut down LeBron for the rest of the regular season. There is some sympathy for fans who have taken measures to make these games. It is especially hard on a weekend when fans often travel distances to come. But this is the risk of buying any ticket to any sporting event, there may be circumstances that prevent everyone from playing. Players are just scheduled to appear. If Tiger Woods missed the cut at the Masters, Augusta National was not offering refunds. Nature of the business even if it is upsetting to the fans. The Cavs believe this is the best way to prepare for the playoffs.
This happens in every major sport, perhaps most notoriously this year with the Indianapolis Colts shutting down their starters to avoid injury and rest for the playoffs. Unlike the Colts, who still had an undefeated season on the table, the Cavs really have nothing to play for. It appears that Dwight Howard and the Magic, however, will play out the season. Dwight told Fanhouse last night:
“I’m not jealous. Those guys (Bryant and James) can rest, but I’m going to continue to play,” said Howard after getting 25 points and 13 rebounds in an easy 118-103 victory over the Knicks Friday night. “I think (Coach) Stan’s (Van Gundy) motto is ‘you can rest when you die.”’
Stan Van Gundy, in markedly different approach from Mike Brown, added:
“I don’t know what it gains you…These guys have been playing all year, and they get days off. I don’t understand why everyone thinks that one day off (from a game) is just going to have them rejuvenated…If we ever get there — and that’s a long way to go — but I’d hate to be sitting there in the Finals going ‘we could have had a shot at this if I didn’t rest so-and-so for no damn reason…I’m not saying we’ll get there, but if we do, I want every advantage and I think that’s a lot more important than giving a guy a night off.”
The second half of that quote is a little puzzling but I expect Brown to stick to his philosophy of resting at least James and probably Jamison. One underlying issue with resting LeBron is the chase for the scoring title with Kevin Durant. Durant now leads LeBron by .3 ppg at 30.0 and any limited minutes LeBron might see would negatively affect his average. This is not the primary reason for resting him but keeping him inactive does maintain a more reflective PPG average. Shaq could see some minutes in the final game just to get him running the floor before the playoffs begin. With so many key guys sitting out, there are opportunities for players who otherwise may not be in the rotation to see minutes and prove their worth.
This occurred last night when Sebastian Telfair, in only his second active game with the Cavs since being traded at the deadline, went for 21 points in 30 minutes. Telfair, who has never been a very good shooter, went 8 for 14 from the field and also hit two threes. Delonte West also used the opportunity to tie a career high with 12 assists before he was chased from the game with 2 technical fouls from referee Marc Davis. Jamario Moon also went for 15-6-4 in 35 minutes of play which prompted Windhorst to write afterwards that he may be working his way into a playoff rotation spot:
All season Mike Brown has struggled with who to play, Moon or Jawad Williams. He decided at some point he couldn’t play both and has been yo-yoing them in and out for some time. When the Cavs are at full force there is a chance that neither will play because Antawn Jamison will get minutes at small forward.
However, Moon seems to be proving that he perhaps deserves the time when the playoffs come ahead of Williams. While Williams is more talented offensively, especially at creating his own shot, Moon has shown he is more consistent defensively. Also he will rebound, which Williams doesn’t do well.
These final two games should provide more opportunity for these bench players to gain some confidence and impress the coaching staff. But if Coach Brown does continue to hold out his top players, the Cavs, who saw lost their second game in a row last night, could end the season on a four game losing streak while they gear up for the playoffs.
26 Comments
Van Gundy may be playing with karma here, but as Potvak wrote in the FanHouse piece, the Magic are still playing for something. If they can get ahead of the Lakers, that’s big for them. The Cavs managed to take care of business a bit earlier, thus giving them the chance to rest a few guys.
This is a lot different than the NFL where rest is a bit more controversial. I’m all for Brown giving guys nights off, the downside is a lot less than if an injury were to occur in a meaningless game.
Isn’t it a little disconcerting that we claim to be the deepest team in the league, but when LeBron sits, we can’t even beat the Bulls or the Pacers. If Kobe sits, the Lakers are at least able to pull off some wins. A little scary, if you ask me.
@2 That’s the ultimate difference in overall depth of talent and why LeBron James is far more important to the Cavaliers then Kobe Bryant is to the Lakers.
However prior to seeing Bosh get his face blasted I’d have not been in favor of so much rest for the Cavaliers but that changed my mind. They can’t afford to suffer an injury in a meaningless game. I just hope with all the off time the guys have been working on their free throws because that could be a bigger problem then an injury.
Except we’re not just sitting LeBron. He also sat
Against the bulls:
West
Gibson
Jamison out by the end of the game
Against the Pacers:
Jamison
Gibson
LeBron
Mo
(shaq)
Against the bulls we had only one player on the court who could create his own shot. Against the pacers we sat a full line. The Lakers win without Kobe, but not without Kobe/Bynum and 2-3 more
Agree with #4.
This gets blown out of proportion too often.
We are deeper than the Lakers, doesn’t mean that one of their bench players can do more than one of ours, we just have more that compliment each other.
Cribbage, the goal here is to win the championship not to win some regular season game. Name me any team in the NBA that can lose its best player and still win it all. For me, having a team that is just able to make the playoffs and get smoked in the first round is no consolation prize.
Didn’t the Magic rest players last year? I think Van Gundy is playing mind games. he thinks he’s Phil Jackson. By the way, Mike Brown’s mentor, Popovich, always rested guys towards the end of the year. How many championships did they win???
Think about it this way: if Brown plays LeBron, who then gets hit with a season-ending injury and–it could happen–no longer sees another game as a Cav, just imagine the scorn that would rain down on the coach, fairly or not. He’d practically be run out of town. The chances of that happening are not great, but the consequences would be.
Besides, as Scott points out, the Magic and Cavs do not have the same situation at hand here, which means that Brendan’s comparison between “philosophies” is a little wobbly; and as Swig points out, we’ve been resting more than LeBron. We’re seeing the Cavs take advantage of the position they earned for themselves atop the NBA. I’d be surprised if the windbag Steve V.G. maintained his Clint Eastwood-like “you can rest when you die” line if it were the Magic sitting on top. The Magic have been playing the best over the last month; they also lost 8 games in January and now they have to make up for it.
Lebron is such a large part of our team that i wouldnt expect use to win with out him cause we play a completely different game which nobody is used to. But i think it’s good making other players step up and fill in with out LBJ.
Id still keep playing Z to get his rhythm back, even tho he will be very valuable against the lakers
AC mentioned in the game last night that the rest our starters are getting now is a reward for what they did during the season.
It’s not just about “rest” as in getting players massages or having them stay off their legs; it is, more significantly, about protecting your team’s assets so that they are available for contests that truly matter. That’s the point Steve Van Gundy misses in his typically hasty comments.
Were not worried about J.J. Hickson
it seems like howard and van gundy do nothing but watch cavs games and critique
Funny observation, cninja. It does seem like a bunch of pre-playoffs propaganda coming from Orlando. This quote from the Large-Size Gundy Airbag, in particular, jumps out as being totally disingenuous:
“I’d hate to be sitting there in the Finals going ‘we could have had a shot at this if I didn’t rest so-and-so for no damn reason…”
Now, tell us, Steve, just HOW WOULD YOU KNOW that you had lost a game in June because back in April, when faced with the Pacers or pick-your-meaningless-match-up, you protected one of your best players by sitting him? The connection is so threadbare as to be laughable in its meaninglessness.
Nice, try, fatso.
Back to reality: the Magic are coming to Cleveland. Bring on the bench! Let’s go Telfair! Gimme some Boobie! This could be Powe’s big game! Just how good are Jawad and Jamario?
“You can rest when you die.”
Or, you can rest when you get a season ending injury in a game that means nothing to playoff position. They are really reaching here.
phil, SVG was referring to the possibility of getting home-court advantage over LA in the finals, not some vague connection like you said. So resting players now might be the difference of playing the decisive game 7 at home versus on the road.
I could care less what anyone else thinks about what Mike Brown is doing with the Cavs here. They took care of business and don’t want to risk injury. It is their right since they clinched. If these other teams were as good as the Cavs, and already clinched everything they can, they would rest too. It is so funny how jealous others get at our success.
@Perfundle: Perhaps, but I think my point remains. S.V.G. tried to make a connection between what may happen in the Finals — be it having home advantage or scoring an all-out victory — and a decision to rest a player or not in April. Either way we read it, it’s trumped up, flatulent, and, I wouldn’t put it past him, likely motivated by the desire to bait Brown out of his cautious approach.
@Perfundle: on second thought, I can see your point better if I consider — as I didn’t before — that S.V.G. was speaking only about his own team. Somehow, I assumed that he was making a backdoor comment on Brown’s decision to rest players. That’s probably where I misread the quote.
OK, so these are NOT two radically different philosophies, nor is there a real confrontation between coaches here. I stand corrected. Let the game begin!
I think Mike Brown is just taking a page from Eric Mangini. SVG doesn’t know who’s starting! HOW WILL HE KNOW WHO TO PREPARE FOR!??!?!?
I’d love to see our bench keep it close today, if not come out with the win. Talk about a psychological edge there.
@MattC: yeah, it’s pretty much a no-lose situation. So, you beat our bench, so what? Or, so, you were smacked down by our bench, ouch!
i think there is something to be said about finishing strong. i get a sense that with this thing already in the bag the team is just going thru the motions, and i can’t help but feel that it might come back to bite us if we are not careful. i agree w/ #2, you’d think that our bench would still be able to put away the pacers. im just sayin.
@ Todd – I am very sympathetic to the finishing strong argument, and if I had my druthers, we’d go out full strength and annihilate the Magic and Hawks. But, it’s just not worth risking an injury, especially with dirty players like Matt Barnes running around out there gunning for LeBron.
@Todd — consider that, whoever it is, our first-round opponent will not present a serious challenge. We will have plenty of time to turn up the intensity then while working in Shaq and getting our rotations working smoothly.
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