Running down the Cleveland Browns and the rest of the AFC North with @SteelersDepot – WFNY Podcast – 2014-07-29
July 29, 2014Art Modell’s grave waterer to be charged
July 29, 2014We found out recently that Josh Gordon hired Richard Sherman’s lawyer to help handle his appeal with the NFL. In that case Maurice Suh called into question the specimen collection process and created doubt around the “he-said, he-said” case between the player and the collector. Now, Pro Football Talk is reporting what Josh Gordon’s strategy heading into the appeal on August 1. No surprise, the argument will once again center on the sample.
In the NFL, drug tests are split into two samples. They test one and then depending on the result test the second to double check. Here’s what PFT has to say.
For Gordon, the âAâ bottle showed a concentration of 16 ng/ml, only one nanogram per milliliter above the limits of 15. The âBâ bottle showed a concentration of 13.6 ng/ml â less than the threshold.
But because the âAâ bottle was labeled âAâ and not âBâ and because the âBâ bottle was labeled âBâ and not âAâ, the end result is a positive and a minimum one-year banishment from the NFL. Flip the bottles when itâs time to apply the labels, and Gordon isnât facing a suspension.
The really interesting thing to me was what PFT stated before these details: Josh Gordon has passed at least 70 drug tests according to PFT’s source and was really close to passing this test as well. ESPN’s Adam Schefter reports that Gordon’s legal team is hinging their argument on the stated inconsistencies in addition to the potential for the test being skewed by second-hand smoke.
We will see how effective these defenses are. For Gordon, the stakes are high as he faces the road that Justin Blackmon has traveled with an indefinite ban requiring application for reinstatement. Josh Gordon and the Browns would rather see him win a fight over the sample collection process (and the potential cause) regardless of how minute the technicality might be.
Then again, even as Josh Gordon has passed over 70 tests, he’s always one test away from finding himself out.
[Also see:Â A look at Kyle Shanahanâs Zone Run Game, Part I: Cleveland Browns Film Room]
(Photo: Scott Sargent/WFNY)
76 Comments
Didn’t this work for Ryan Braun?
This can also be a small out for the NFL in the wake of the Ray Rice debacle.
This is an A/B conversation, so C your way out before D tells E to knock you the F out, G.
Air traffic controllers have a 50 nanogram per sample threshold but NFL players have a 15n limit. Makes sense…
The PFT source is slightly confused. Josh Gordon passed 70 “tests about drugs, where he had to identify the drug based on the type of high it gave him.
He did not pass a “drug test.”
I’m a complete homer on this, but shouldn’t both samples have to generate a positive for any action to be taken?
16 ng/ml of what, exactly?
If Samples A and B are taken at the same time, how do they have different concentrations? (Average them and he’s fine! đ )
Air traffic controllers have to keep calm amid chaos đ
Indeeb. BUT, they can’t be reaching for the Doritos in the midst of said chaos.
THC.
This sample error has to be part of a competent attorneys argument, no?
I’d assume. I mean, isn’t part of B to verify A, anyway?
Not according to the drug policy hi-lighted in the PFT report.
Yep and according to the policy if A is positive B only needs to show the presence of the substance, not meet the threshold, to count as a positive/fail. If they had been labeled B & A instead of A & B then A would never have triggered the positive and subsequent testing of B. Seems like a field day for an attorney.
True, I was sort of thinking out loud. It just seems odd that there is no protocol for cases like this other than, “Welp, the one we labelled first was dirty, so let’s go with that.”
Agreed. Seems like pretty solid grist for an attorney.
This could be huge, especially with an attorney who has a successful track record in this regard. It might significantly reduce the suspension or even eliminate it entirely.
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if/when Gordon would face another separate suspension hearing in the near future for his DUI case?
ok, sure, like this sort of testing fail safe procedure is so random in its labeling and isn’t it ironic that pot isn’t exactly performance enhancing and Ray Rice and blahblahblah. How does this help the mess that is Josh Gordon? Since his notification he’s added an additional DUI and riding in cars with, uh, friends who happen to be holding and blazing, all while knowing he’s under double secret probation and facing indefinite (no, not necessarily a year, indefinite) banishment to life as a Home Depot employee.
We’re all willing to forget the person and just lose our minds over the possibility he might suit up for a few games this season before he tests positive again. Doing these things repeatedly after knowing your very livelihood is at stake should not provoke “everybody parties” or “Ray Rice is worse.” The young man is self-destructive. If the Browns wanted to try and help they might have said to Goodell weeks ago: “While you decide, we’re suspending him for a year to keep him inside the walls and escort him getting help and maybe taking away the game will help. If you want to stick a league suspension on him you’re pulling him out of our reach. Don’t do that.” Yes, there is a league protocol but lots of these appeals are reduced for worse ostensible reasons.
What we all seem to be overlooking is the disparity between sample A and sample B. When we are talking about nanograms.. 2.4 is a huge jump. These were split from the same sample and the tests jumped that much? How can you possibly get an accurate measurement?
To which I imagine his attorney is saying, “THANK YOU!!”
We’re talking about pot here dude. A minuscule amount at that. He’s not going to be on an episode of Intervention.
And suddenly, just like that – SNAP! – everyone loves the lawyer.
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nope. We’re talking about multiple positives in college when he knew he would be tested at multiple schools, after interventions and counseling and getting kicked out of the Baylor program. We’re talking about multiple instances in his two years in the pros. Matter of fact, Josh hasn’t gone any extended period of time since college without a positive test, though he knew he would be tested. We’re talking about something else. Dude.
That might get plead down to reckless operation.
No, we’re talking about a guy that (A) can’t prioritize or focus on the things in life that really matter, and (B) is willing to sacrifice all of those great things for a minuscule amount of pot.
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Doubtful. People in NFL do not get suspended for that
Next time, maybe he can jump up and down a few times, maybe run in place to make sure everything is mixed up good.
The NFL doesn’t currently suspend for a first-time DUI, although they are moving towards a system that would suspend for one game for a first-time DUI. Gordon would lose two game paychecks under the current policy, though.
Gordon would be pumped, but wouldn’t matter from a suspension standpoint… current NFL policy doesn’t suspend for a first-time DUI/DWI.
I’m just saying that it’s not life or death. Financially it is but not physically. He needs to cut all ties with everyone he knows that could lead him down the wrong path and for most people that means losing life long friends.
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So . . . we’re not talking about pot. I agree.
The Braun defense hinged on chain of custody of the sample. The person who had the sample did not take it directly to be mailed as was agreed upon policy and instead waited to do so over the weekend.
It was a mucho technicality. Some really good lawyerin’.
How much is 16 ng/ml? Can that occur naturally?
Because of pot.
Which has apparently demonstrated itself to be a bad thing for Josh Gordon. A destructive thing, even.
yes, must avoid CFS*
*cheesey finger syndrome
I did find it hilarious that they made him personally call and apologize to season ticket holders.
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/09/06/ryan-braun-calls-brewers-season-ticket-holders-to-apologize/
For what it’s worth, to be convicted in Ohio for “OVI–drugs” you need to have > or = 10 ng of marijuana in your urine. 13.6 ng/16 ng suggests that Gordon still had his bake on.
it is well above the actual legal limit if they test you. so, I’ll go out on a limb and say that it cannot occur naturally.
now, cue someone noting that it is a natural substance
That’s what I assumed. Felt kinda dumb after I asked.
this is the fuzzy math section for what I could find earlier.
Gordon failed a test (now reportedly, after initial reports were he missed a test, then reports that he had a diluted sample — YAAAYYYY!!!!).
Gordon was arrested for speeding with pot in the car (not technically in his possession, but it doesn’t help).
Gordon was arrested for a DUI.
how does the DUI not fall into the same category as a positive pot test? or does it?
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at the end of the day, Gordon deserves the suspension. he may somehow avoid it or get it reduced though.
Gordon deserves to be suspended. And, it might be the one thing he needs to snap priorities of his life in order. Or maybe that wouldn’t even help.
But, as far as a couple extra wins this season, then yeah, gotta love the lawyer potentially finding that one loophole and holding on tight.
note: I don’t hate lawyers. It is not their fault the system was setup in a way that it was, so they are merely playing their role. I love you man! đ
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This is the problem I have with the way the NFL suspends and fines people. The penalties end up seeing arbitrary.
And then you get into crazy arithmetic where punching your spouse is half a positive drug test which is twice an in-game stomp which is an eighth of vehicular manslaughter which is….
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Yeah, I think the DUI is its own thing… not considered a drug and not related to the drug section. We’ll soon find out, though. On a personal level, I think Gordon must be a grade-A moron to keep putting himself in these situations and risk his NFL career over it, but I still want him to get let off the hook because I’m a Browns fan and I want to use him as a keeper in a fantasy football league.
I blame Scott Fujita.
no, seriously (he was our player representative). The NFLPA did an absolutely horrible job on the last CBA in terms of the policy structure and it has constantly reared it’s ugly head in all of these issues. They better have cleaned up their act the next time this comes around because the NFL owners’ lawyers destroyed them on all that stuff last time.