While We’re Waiting… Cavs in freefall, Bill Veek and the problem of tanking
March 28, 2012Madden 13 – Browns fans win as Haden falls to Rodgers
March 28, 2012Somehow over the last few days people are under the impression that the Browns stated confidence in Colt McCoy is proof positive that he will be the starter this season. Certainly on the heels of failing to get Robert Griffin III the Browns are talking up the QB that they presently have on their roster. What else could they possibly say about the guy who could end up under center to start this season if they can’t find someone better? My biggest problem is that people seem to be buying into what the Browns are saying as if they’ve said something definitive and that they aren’t going to draft a quarterback like Ryan Tannehill. So let’s look at the facts.
On Monday Tom Heckert talked to Mary Kay Cabot at the owners meetings and said that the Browns really like Tannehill, “but we’ve got Colt. That’s kind of our deal. That doesn’t mean we’re not going to take somebody, but we’re fine with Colt as our quarterback.”
I don’t know exactly what Tom Heckert is saying any more than anyone else, does, but it sure seems like he is talking out of both sides of his mouth. On the one hand, he wants to show some confidence in Colt McCoy. On the other hand he wants everyone to know that the Browns aren’t averse to taking a quarterback in the draft. Whether the last part is to keep other teams on their toes about the Browns draft plans, remains to be seen.
Tuesday, Pat Shurmur added to the list of quotes saying “We’re moving forward with Colt – – with the understanding that there’s going to be some competition to make sure that we put the right guy on the field. At this point, Colt is our quarterback. I’ve said it all along – we’re looking forward to him getting better and being our guy.”
Later, Shurmur said, “With 13 draft choices now, the addition of four compensatory picks, we’ll have the ability to do a lot of things. I wouldn’t say that we’re definitely going to make changes at the quarterback position, but I’d say there’s a chance.”
And then, let’s go all the way back to March 19th when Mike Holmgren talked to Dave Mahler in Seattle about Colt McCoy after the Browns’ failed trade attempt.
” I think he’s a competitive guy. He understands this business. He and I had a really good talk before he left in the off-season. And he knew there was going to be competition coming into this next off-season and next training camp.”
Somehow over the last two days, these things have become to be interpreted that the Browns are definitively going to go into next season with Colt McCoy as the starter, when all I think they mean is that as of right now, they’re prepared to do so and they’re not afraid of the prospect. That does not mean that if they have a chance to draft a guy at the right time in the right spot that they wouldn’t do so with the aim of having him replace Colt McCoy on the depth chart.
We also got word on Tuesday that the Browns would host a workout for Ryan Tannehill.
My only takeaways are that the Browns do like Colt McCoy, but not so much that they wouldn’t make him compete with a player from the draft. If that happens to be Ryan Tannehill, let’s hope the Browns are right to like him. I don’t have any warm fuzzy feelings about Tannehill yet other than he seems like he looks like the prototype at 6’4″. That ultimately doesn’t mean much in the scheme of things.
Until the Browns prove otherwise, I am assuming they’re excited about Ryan Tannehill. Nothing I’ve heard from the Browns so far precludes it.
30 Comments
Yeah, I made a comment on the one article yesterday that the use of language like “He’s going to be a ‘fine’ player in ‘this league'” doesn’t really instill much confidence about their intensions for this going in the long term. Whether they’re trying to or not, the Front Office isn’t really making a big effort to hide the truth from the fans or its players.
I don’t believe a word of what they are saying about much of anything. I do think that the best course of action at this point is giving Colt 100% support and every opportunity to succeed. I don’t think they are serious about drafting Tannehill. I’d like to give them enough credit to think that once they saw they were out of the running for #2, the figured that the best thing they could do between now and the draft was to create an artificial market for the next QB in the pecking order, taking note of the fact that Jake Locker got picked in the top 10 last year, and that 4 QB’s were gone by pick 15.
If that’s the con they are pulling (and I hope it is) then my hat is off to them.
Can we draft that girl standing next to him? I wouldn’t mind that.
Dream Scenario:
Miami panics that we want Tannehill and trades up to #3 with Minnesota to leapfrog us (I don’t think they would trade with us because that sort of defeats the purpose of needing to get above us).
Kalil, the drafts best LT, now sits in our slot. We don’t need a LT. We open up the bidding to TB, StL, JAX, and Minny. We end up getting a 1st next year to drop down a few slots to Minny’s pick (they got more to trade down, so they were willing — we get the worse of the 2×2013 picks they have between theirs and Miami’s).
So, now we sit at #8, with a ’13 1st rounder banked, and Richardson falling to us there. I prefer Blackmon to Richardson overall, but I prefer Richardson + ’13 1st rounder to Blackmon.
Ok, not going to happen, but a fun thought 🙂
look alive, 7 round mock is up.
FROM ME!
i got us blackmon, martin, weeden.
#FUN
wow have things gotten that bad for Burfict?? 5th round for the former projected Top 15 pick, i’ll take it!
You know what’ll happen the Browns will trade down out of four perhaps with St. Louis and they’ll draft Tannehill. You won’t get that stud CB, RB or WR and instead you’ll get another backup/competitor and have to wait until #22 to probably draft another OL. All they’ll get is an extra first rounder next year and we can play the draft game all over a year from now.
i actually did not try to shoehorn him to the browns. it’s just where the grading shook out. he did not have a good combine.. was just a hair faster than dontari poe (top nose tackle).
They’re just doing due diligence here, either in case he drops significantly after they don’t take him at #4 or to make sure other potential trading partners think it’s possible they’ll take him. There is ZERO chance they take Tannehill at #4. Holmgren is already on record saying we need to draft somebody who starts right away and Tannehill is a project. Even if we didn’t have somebody they think is competent at QB this guy would be a huge reach at #4 overall anyway. It’s just that the best QB’s in the draft are going 1 and 2, so he’s next. If they take him they will have passed on some elite talent, both offensive and defensive, for what will be a marginal upgrade at best at QB, at least for the first year or two. Tannehill has nice potential, but this isn’t the NBA draft, and you don’t take flyers on top 10 picks in the NFL.
Btw, the article that says “host a workout for Tannehill” seems to actually mean “be present at his pro day like a bunch of other teams.”
Jim, curious: Is there a reason you waited for that Temple RB? Wasn’t there anyone else higher up to take that would be more explosive for this very important skill position hole we have?
Burfict will be lucky to get drafted before the 7th round.
at the combine, he went on to blame his terrible season and on-field (and off-field) issues on his coaching staff. then, went to show his fabulous work-ethic by not only blowing every single drill, but doing worse than a majority of the DL in them (shuttle drills, etc.)
add in that his tape shows he only goes for the big hits, is terrible in coverage and apparently won’t listen to coaches and you have a HUGE risk on your hands
no.thank.you.
Tight end? Sorry.
i guess you could swap out cyrus gray in the 4th the boise DE. the interesting mid-tier RBs -turbin, pead, james- evaporated at the end of the 3rd round. (but to answer your question,, no reason. pierce was a good producer but also benefitted from a stud line, evan rodriguez, and playing in the MAC. still, pierce has some decent grades. agreed neither he nor poole are likely to unseat hardesty.)
hey Jim, your link isn’t working for me, so I don’t know if you have the full 1st round or if you just have the Browns picks?
Blackmon at #4 is good by me. So would Claiborne or Richardson really too.
who are we picking Martin over? just wondering where you have him and Glenn rated (I have Glenn a hair above Martin and think Cordy is a RT in the NFL).
you know I don’t like your pick at #37, but that’s fine. i’d be targeting M.Sanu (if no Blackmon), Osemele (if no RT in 1st), L.Miller or D.Wilson (if no Richardson), or Lavonte David (WOLB starter from day1).
I really like your 3rd and 4th rounds. I think that we likely use those picks to jump up and grab somebody in the late 2nd round, but if we stand pat and end up with those guys, then I will not complain.
everything 5th and later is shots in the dark for the most part. Pierce isn’t a dynamic RB, so I’d be a bit disappointed honestly. I don’t want any part of Burfict.
Prater is solid but no real ceiling. I think that we go after a guy with a high ceiling as they’ll have to compete with Dmitri and Skrine just to get on the field. also, with robinson in-fold, I don’t even think he’d make the roster.
Drafting Poole means that he and Pierce are likely fighting for 1 open spot on the roster. Not a bad plan, but also means we are relegating the slot already.
Burris, Thomas and Mosely are shots in the dark, which is what you get there. I have my favorites there too, but really, hard to say at that point.
This (and the Prater example) are why I think that we more likely use picks to move up and go after better guys in the bottom of the 2nd or 3rd round. we don’t have 13 spots open on our 53man roster. we have 13 draft picks. so, we will likely try to bank more picks for future seasons and/or combine picks to move up to target specific players.
and I HATE that we can’t trade those compensatory picks. 4 guys at the end of the draft instead of sweeteners to use to go after higher guys.
shoot. try this.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArCP1PYtyMA8dGhTbnBnQTBXRENrazBTb294TzFnQkE&authkey=CIX3ldUM#gid=22
yes, as you suspected, i have adams, glenn, reiff off the board before martin.
know your feelings on weeden but found it irresistable to pair him with blackmon. he wont be there in 3rd.. feel certain KC grabs him or cousins in the 2nd.
and also.. yes — shots in the dark from 5 on. need to go back and refine team-by-team based on their FA signings. still.. #FUN!
It’s a shame you did all that work watch as the Browns blow it up and do the complete opposite to conventional wisdom.
That’s why he’s Burfict not Perfect… hyuck hyuck hyuck
Just curious, would you have grabbed David Wilson if he hadn’t been taken one pick ahead of the Browns in the 2nd round, or were you going to take Weeden anyway?
Browns really should keep quiet for a while. Media is going to rip them regardless of what they say.
Why would anyone even think that the Browns would go into this season with McCoy as their 1st option unless it was an absolute necessity?
The media is whipping themselves into a tizzy like “They said they liked Colt, then they made a play for Griffin and Bradford, now they’re saying they like Tannehill, They’re all over the place!”
Anyone who saw McCoy play last year knows the Browns will need a new QB ASAP. They tried to get two better QBs, which didn’t work. Unfortunately, that leaves McCoy as their current best option – they HAVE to back him somewhat, they’re not going to tell you he’s plan C, why would they do that!? It should be very obvious what’s happening here, why’s the media acting all dumb?
The criteria for taking a QB in the first round: You can build a team around him to one day win a superbowl. There were only two QB’s in this draft like that. My sense is they are trying to create a fool’s market for the next Joe Flacco.
interesting that last year Heckert seems to view the middle rounds, rather than the late rounds, as the slots to swing for the fences. He gave up the third rounder and used the fourth round for Cameron and Marecic, both projects. And he used the 5th and 7th round for Pinkston and Hagg, who had nice college careers but maybe appeared to have just fringe athleticism for this level. The compensatory picks are later rounds, and maybe he’ll keep those again to grab productive college types and dangle the middles to slide up in the third round.
Agree with mgbode above, 13 draftees can’t make the roster, 8 would be a lot so it points to draft day deals. It’s nice to have plenty of ammo.
thank you, that link works.
oh, and to be clear, I meant 5th round picks on are shots in the dark in general. wasn’t being specific to your selections (basically there’s high ceiling guys who haven’t put it together yet and there’s low ceiling guys who won’t be much more than okay depth at best). the occasional Colston, Brady excluded 🙂
i know. tweaked it after i posted it. the BPA thing really doesnt play until rounds 4 on imo. (eg, the giants are NOT taking devon still with their 1st rd pick, forgot titans signed wimbley, etc…) plus i was too harsh on coples, osemele and probably kirkpatrick.
would love to see your take bode, my fellow wonk.
my picks based on how your draft played out. trying not to “look ahead” but just pick based on what happened to that point for #fun
1a Blackmon, WR, OkieState
1b Martin, OT, Stanford
(w/ L.Miller gone sadly)
2 D.Still, DT, Penn State
(ridiculous rotation DTs for us as he is BPA by far for me of who is left there. can’t pass him up)
3 R.Lewis WOLB, Oklahoma
(need slightly over BPA here but not much)
4a N.Foles, QB, Arizona
(highest ceiling middle round QB to me)
4b S.Spence WOLB, Miami
(we need LBer depth and speed. with Lewis and Spence, we now have both)
5a B.Massie, OT, Ole Miss
(way too high a value to pass up here and we need OT depth anyway)
5b J.Criner, WR, Arizona
(I think he’s a 2nd round talent here in the 5th. snag him)
6a Jackson, FS, McNeese St
(need a safety, not enamored with any, haven’t seen this guy, why not?)
6b Smith, RB, Utah St
(like him better than Pierce and Poole. Again, he’s not going to ‘wow’ anybody)
7a Childs, WR, Arkie
(okay, we drafted 3 WRs. 2 of them better step up bigtime)
7b Thomas, FS, Arkie
(back to back Arkies and another FS. tough to make the roster if he’s guy #12 drafted)
7c Miller, DE WVU
sure thing. here’s my 1st round take:
Richardson and SJAX in StL? Wow. Both can run, catch and block, so they can all be in the same packages too.
I do find humor in JAX taking yet another speed-rush DE (but it is still a need for them)
Carolina could use a CB, but I think they definitely go DT. Brockers would be my pick for them, but Poe or Fletcher works too.
Upshaw as DE or OLB for Seattle? He could technically play either. Carroll sort of minimizes the importance of LBer in his scheme (and puffs up their stats), so I wouldn’t be surprised to see them go DE (assuming they re-sign Hawthorne)
Floyd and Fitz is fun to think about, but man, Kolb would have to hate the idea of getting back behind that OL.
Glenn, L.Miller to Cinci
Brockers to Pitt
M.Sanu to Balt
Just take 4 of my favorite guys and give them to our biggest rivals (all make sense too). Well, thank you for preparing me for the worst there 🙂
Adams > Reiff – I would be surprised. Could happen, but Reiff is so much more refined. Also, Cutler would be very happy to have Carimi coming back and Reiff at RT too.
already mentioned L.David.
Coples did take a Bowers-like tumble on your board. I don’t like him and could see him fall, but I’d guess a team earlier would take a chance on him (Tenn at 20?)
Seeing as how “that girl” is his WIFE, if we drafted her, we would get him, too.
Shame on you. Shame.
Please don’t take Tannehill at 4 (or 6). Please, please don’t.
Im hoping our interest in Tannehill is simply a smoke screen to scare the dolphins ( and Sherman)
Um, Tim Couch anyone. Couch was 6-4 with a high completion % in college too. Where’s he been for the last 10 years? As I recall the Browns front office did not even look at Donovan McNabb that year – ’cause he ran around too much.
I think they are having Tannehill in to try to get the Dolphins to trade up to #4 or it could be that they want to know what Tannehill can do in case the Dolphins pass on him at #8. If he gets past the Fish then he could slide to us at #22 or we might trade the #22 up to the mid-late teens to get Tannehill there.